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I've got to admit, the Zen people have the best stories.":O}

Discussion in 'Enlightenment Games' started by Daniel~, Dec 2, 2016.

  1. cloasters

    cloasters Well-Known Member

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    I don't understand why punishing myself seems mandatory most of the time. Was I really that bad to others? Maybe so, but I hope not.
    We're all capable of cruelty, it would be nice if we can stop being cruel to ourselves. Tall order in my case, but the trouble is that suffering does NOT "lay up those treasures in heaven."

    Wasn't it Archie Bell and the Drells that sang "lighten up?" Shucks, it was "tighten up," which is great for musicians but I have serious doubts about that policy for life in general.
  2. Daniel~

    Daniel~ Chief BBS Administrator Staff Member

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    I think we internalize the way the world treats us, thinks of us, when we are still quite young and incapable of defending ourselves against our antagonists..

    .Who are most often parents and family and friends. Those we care most about. As we care for them we take to heart how they see us.
    So we punish ourselves for past sins.

    This rarely helps as for the most part, the sins we punish are not our own, but those which were piled upon us.

    So "if" this is the case ,corrective measures will be difficult. We must turn away from those we love and who quite often love us...I'm speaking Mentally and emotionally. I'm speaking internally, not externally. One does not need to abandon father and mother, to separate one's own views from those handed to us and that we swallowed whole hog because of our affection or because we are in need of affection.

    I've had my share of this!":O}

    So what are we to do. Nothing can be obtained here by force!

    We are dealing with a child for Pete's sake!
    We are dealing with our past selfs, not just the past but who we were or thought we were in that past.
    This is our inner self and our inner self remains a child for life! Not childish! But a child, an innocent.
    The innocence of our natures comes wrapped up in our ignorance, our lack of discernment due to lack of experience.

    The danger of innocence is that it will accept a lie from a loved one until time reveals it and it must be abandon. for a better truth.

    As all this is happening we move past many things, as we mature. But that doesn't necessarily mean we abandon them. They lay in wait for us. Awaiting an unguarded moment to find what can often be an embarrassingly stupid or childish expression. We just never really got around to examining it critically..

    In the end our only defense lies in strict and continues self examination.
    That we are experiencing the pain of a child is often something we just don't see or understand. We see only the error we were punished for in the past and in the past that error was punished rather than corrected.

    So seeing the error we punish ourselves as our loved one's punished us.

    It's so difficult because we carry the Child and the things of the child very deeply.

    So much so that direct action against this self abuse would not be wise. To much that is good and beautiful within us is ours only when we remain open to this innocence one within us.

    The only way to make progress in this situation is by making energetic progress in the good, thus leaving
    self abuse ever more further behind us,

    You and I don't need to be punished. We need to understand that our liabilities come wrapped in our innocence. That the faults we carry were often handed to us when we were to young to understand that there is always a choice to be made.

    So here's a paradox
    When we are in need of correction it is innocence that allows correction to occur!!
    it is by way of innocents that we can take corrective measure into the deepest stratum of our being.

    We must l;earn to correct rather than to condemn. innocence can teach us how to do this. For the very essence of innocence is Love.

    It has been said that the sage has that innocence of a child and the cunning of a dragon!
    Why does a sage need the cunning of a Dragon?
    To PROTECT his innocence.!

    Next time you feel in need of punishment Look more closely your only in need of correction and this is had , as I have said, by way of strict and continuous self examination.
    Cultivate Clarity

    Some of the down right stupidest things I have ever said came into my mouth not from my brain but from my heart. I was repeating the words of another who in some way impressed me. When we are young and immature We accept many things that we must later drop if we are to progress.

    This is not something we can correct over night. But that doesn't have to slow our progress. We can still make progress. We can still examine, we can still create new understandings within our selves.

    We can still work to save all that can be saved. We can still love ourselves for all our faults. But we must persevere if we are to prevent slow progress from dwindling to nothing.

    We humans were designed to be self correcting and self perfecting...But this takes time...in the end...this takes every minute we have here on Earth.
    We will leave this world far from perfect.

    But know this! God glories in our imperfections. God rejoices in our struggles.
    It is in our effort to grow that we grow near to him that sent us. Not in growth itself.
    The gap between imperfection and perfection is just to immensely great.

    We never impress with out perfection that which is perfection itself.

    The phone is ringing George, put aside what pain you can and answer the call.

    we just need to learn to grow quite and answerer the calling.
    the more I see of the path before us.
    The more willing I am to allow the life I was given to fore-fill itself according to the nature I was given. Rather than egotistically seeking my own will.

    This means restraint. This means cultivating humility that allows us to see our faults and start to correct them in gentleness.

    "In the finale analysis Patience means putting the brakes upon strength."

    When we are not strong we are not being patient, we are waiting. Waiting in time CAN create the strength needed to go on. To go on we must penetrate and understand what is oppressing us. Nothing penetrates a thing like GENTLENESS

    For it is only the gentle that can penetrate to the deepest core of ourselves without injury. Nothing is more penetrating than the gentle. Nothing promotes clarity like the Gentle. To be kind is most often to be gentle. The gentle brings about clarity without sharpness that can injure with it's harsh insights..
    If a man acts badly we see this right away. The gentle is what allows us to make exceptions. The man maybe acting badly because he is injured and not himself. The gentle and penetrating can tell us this and lead us to a proper solution.
    .Even clarity must be gentle to penetrate what is deepest and best within us.
    Try to rememberer it is not for you to judge you, only to try to correct you

    Judgment lies in the hands that fashioned your life. Do you real think he made all this just to judge it?

    If God withholds judgment, and he must or we would have all perished long long ago. Then should we not be cautious in our judgments?
    "Judge not lest ye be judged"
    Applies to self judgment as much as judging others.
  3. cloasters

    cloasters Well-Known Member

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    Shazam, it is wonderful to read how kindness to others as well as kindness to yourself will help stop the cycle of self punishment that comes too easily to me. I try to be as kind as possible to others but have only lately realized how fine grained this kindness must be. Thank you very much Dan, you are extremely helpful!
  4. Daniel~

    Daniel~ Chief BBS Administrator Staff Member

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    My friend you have all I ever knew sitting upon a shelf.

    Remember, this will not be easy! This is the work of a lifetime.. I'm almost 69 and I have barely begun to understand what I am to do. So keep in mind what has been said here about struggle. It is not perfection in us that God loves, he already has that in inter-Galactic abundance.

    Remember according to many myths God created perfect Angels before he decide he preferred imperfection that seeks perfection to actual perfection. At lest in humans.

    He wants us to curb evil and further the good, this means struggle. This means opposition and obstructions This means having to endure times of great darkness that must over time be resolved and overcome.

    There are no quick fixes. There is struggle and effort and the reward of knowing your pursuing the Good.So go slow, be patient.

    You need not fear a strong will, will not prevail. When you start down this road in earnest you will find the strength as needed. NOT as wanted however, just as needed.

    WE must use our strength to gain in strength.Sometimes, nay, often we feel that the strength will never come to us, often we become completely convinced it will never come...right before it arrives Just as all our strength is gone.

    "God may not be there when we want him, but he is always there on time"
    Allan Anderson

    But know that once the battle is joined in earnest
    The out come is not in doubt.

    We will prevail as that is the will of Heaven.
  5. cloasters

    cloasters Well-Known Member

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    All you ever knew, I doubt that would fit on any shelf. Well, any less than any library sized shelf.
  6. Daniel~

    Daniel~ Chief BBS Administrator Staff Member

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    "The I-Ching contains the Measure of Heaven and Earth. If it were not the most Divine thing on Earth, How could it do this?

    One of the old guys of ancient China.

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